Bestla
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Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:11 am

The older a server gets the more imbalanced it gets. It ends with players either stops or move to a yonger server. My server starts to look like
a ghost server. Most cities have a population between 2-5.

A way to solve this would be to reset it regular. Let a season be maby three month and have a score-board. Perhaps let the top three get a vanity price. This would prevent the inbalance to grow until a majority loose interest.
 
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Shu
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:57 am

They are trying to merge the server soon as their solution to low population servers.
 
Bestla
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:44 am

I were talking about the game not being balanced. Which might be a reason to old servers being abandoned. If you merge an old server with a new you inject the new with the balance problem the old have evolved over time. If you merge an old server with an old you get a higher populated unbalanced server. Merging servers solves population issues, not balance issues.
 
Bestla
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:01 am

The problem lays in the game mechanics. I will try to explain.
1. If you put a resource node on the ground both a weak player and a powerful player can pick it up. The powerful player can later on loot the weak players home for part of the resource. Say for the sake of the argument that the weak gets 0.75% node and the powerful gets 1.25%

2. The powerful player can rob all the escorted wagons he/she wants from the week player. Say the week player gets 0.75% of each days wagons and the powerful gets 1.25%

3. The powerful players gets the governor spots and advertiser spots which generates resources faster. When the inequality have reached a certain point the weak players are stuck in their starting citys with the lowest generation speed possible on resources. Houses don't even want them to move out since they cannot protect them all and part of all resources they collect goes to the enemy side.

4 The powerful players gets more resources from the mirror each day which also makes them grow faster.

So inequality grows over time and makes the game less interresting to play after a while.

Other games use different solutions to avoid this problem. If you look at mmorpgs they have zones for different levels. In most pvp games or pvp elements in pve/pvp games they have mechanics that match players after strenght. A ladder you climb higher up when you get stronger. There are many different solutions to avoid this problem. I suggested seasons with resets since it would require the least change to the game. And it is really fun until the inequality gets too big.

Hope this explains better what I ment.
 
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:25 am

I think lilith tries to balance the inequality of power with energy consumption. Energy is probably the only resource that high-power people need which cannot be stolen from low-power people. However, I also think they did a poor job doing it. There should be a reward for low-power people from accepting a duel from high-power people, and even more if low-power people initiating the duel. The reward system currently is honor. But I'm not convinced that the reward is worth the risk, even with the crafting mechanism that uses honor.

And in general, I think this is where liltih is struggling. They have all the great ideas but the execution has been very poor. As enjoyable as it is, the quality of the game is still a BETA standard, and I do not think lilith even have a vision how well they want to bring the quality of this game further. The frequent opening of new server is just an indication of one simple goal.
 
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Shu
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 10:21 am

Bestla wrote:
I were talking about the game not being balanced. Which might be a reason to old servers being abandoned. If you merge an old server with a new you inject the new with the balance problem the old have evolved over time. If you merge an old server with an old you get a higher populated unbalanced server. Merging servers solves population issues, not balance issues.

Yeah, but you need to explain what is imbalanced. You only mentioned about it not being balanced and then went to ghost servers. Don't expect me to read your mind regarding which balance you're talking about as there are many mechanics in the game that needs tweaking.

Bestla wrote:
The problem lays in the game mechanics. I will try to explain.
1. If you put a resource node on the ground both a weak player and a powerful player can pick it up. The powerful player can later on loot the weak players home for part of the resource. Say for the sake of the argument that the weak gets 0.75% node and the powerful gets 1.25%

Simple solution would be hide inside the capital and don't attack any other cities. If you want to stay 100% safe from pillage. Everyone one gets attacked, you can do it yourself as well as it's part of the game mechanic.

In addition, resources that are dropped around the world are not always the same to ALL players, it's RNG the same as the rare items you can possibly get through dungeons. It's just a matter of luck.

Bestla wrote:
2. The powerful player can rob all the escorted wagons he/she wants from the week player. Say the week player gets 0.75% of each days wagons and the powerful gets 1.25%

The more you play, the more you have the chance to get the opportunity with these resources. Not all escorted wagons are seen if you're a powerful player. It's more like the weaker players see the wagons more often that's why it gets annoying for us powerful players that we need to escort our cart away from these weak players who never duels us anyway. The downside, we waste a lot of time escorting them to prevent people from robbing it.

If you're too weak to defend your cart away from bullies, either you attempt to waste their energy by fighting them wasting yours as well or just don't escort it at all if you need your heroes and energy.

Bestla wrote:
3. The powerful players gets the governor spots and advertiser spots which generates resources faster. When the inequality have reached a certain point the weak players are stuck in their starting citys with the lowest generation speed possible on resources. Houses don't even want them to move out since they cannot protect them all and part of all resources they collect goes to the enemy side.

This is only temporary, the usual conquered servers have tons of empty cities they need help with governing. If you're just a casual player and not the competitive type, don't expect so much. But you should find a better house and ask for governor rotation it's not like you're playing this alone right?

Well, you joined the losing side. I don't think Lilith will be able to fix that, if you were on the winning side and having a great house to team up with you, you will not be complaining in the first place. But yeah, they're improving/adding systems to make it more friendly for losing kingdoms that are still playing. You just need to wait for more updates or start by joining a huge group of English speaking houses. You can check the recruitment thread. viewforum.php?f=38

Bestla wrote:
4 The powerful players gets more resources from the mirror each day which also makes them grow faster.

Obviously.

Bestla wrote:
So inequality grows over time and makes the game less interresting to play after a while.

Other games use different solutions to avoid this problem. If you look at mmorpgs they have zones for different levels. In most pvp games or pvp elements in pve/pvp games they have mechanics that match players after strenght. A ladder you climb higher up when you get stronger. There are many different solutions to avoid this problem. I suggested seasons with resets since it would require the least change to the game. And it is really fun until the inequality gets too big.

Hope this explains better what I ment.

This game has zones for different levels (Castle level/Map explored) but currently this is an open world that's why both PvP/PvE aspect applies everywhere (except safe zones).

If you were to match players at their equal strength, houses would become useless as only you two are able to fight, cooperation is very important in the game and if you're not cooperative enough, I don't think you will go anywhere. But you can always help your house to hit lower players from you, I'm sure you're not the lowest in the server aren't you?

About resets, we're still not sure on how will they do the merge but it may be possible.
 
Bestla
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Re: Game not balanced

Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:30 pm

Shu wrote:
This is only temporary, the usual conquered servers have tons of empty cities they need help with governing. If you're just a casual player and not the competitive type, don't expect so much. But you should find a better house and ask for governor rotation it's not like you're playing this alone right?

Well, you joined the losing side. I don't think Lilith will be able to fix that, if you were on the winning side and having a great house to team up with you, you will not be complaining in the first place. But yeah, they're improving/adding systems to make it more friendly for losing kingdoms that are still playing. You just need to wait for more updates or start by joining a huge group of English speaking houses. You can check the recruitment thread. viewforum.php?f=38.


You still missunderstand me. I'm governor and gets one of the advisor spots each week so it is not that I lack resourses. Some of our top players in our kingdom change to the weakest kingdom just to try balance our server and make it playable for a little longer. It might be hard for someone like you to understand but there are players that do not find it satesfying to login to the winning side day after day with nothing challenging to do. If we thought that was fun we would play farmvile.
 
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Shu
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Re: Game not balanced

Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:37 am

Bestla wrote:
Shu wrote:
This is only temporary, the usual conquered servers have tons of empty cities they need help with governing. If you're just a casual player and not the competitive type, don't expect so much. But you should find a better house and ask for governor rotation it's not like you're playing this alone right?

Well, you joined the losing side. I don't think Lilith will be able to fix that, if you were on the winning side and having a great house to team up with you, you will not be complaining in the first place. But yeah, they're improving/adding systems to make it more friendly for losing kingdoms that are still playing. You just need to wait for more updates or start by joining a huge group of English speaking houses. You can check the recruitment thread. viewforum.php?f=38.


You still missunderstand me. I'm governor and gets one of the advisor spots each week so it is not that I lack resourses. Some of our top players in our kingdom change to the weakest kingdom just to try balance our server and make it playable for a little longer. It might be hard for someone like you to understand but there are players that do not find it satesfying to login to the winning side day after day with nothing challenging to do. If we thought that was fun we would play farmvile.

I didn't misunderstood you, I gave a fair example of what usually happens when there's a conquered server, this game is called Art of Conquest for a reason. And if you applied the situation to yourself then that's not my concern. If you enjoy the challenge from the first place, stop complaining about top players robbing your carts, top players getting all the resources from the void mirror and not being safe outside the capital.

If you don't have problem with lack of resources why else would you mention it? And aside from pointing out it's flaws you should at least try to suggest a definite solution for us to discuss with. You don't like to play farmville but when you're hit by a top player you complain. Interesting creature.
 
Bestla
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Re: Game not balanced

Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:55 am

Hos can pointing out that inequality grows over time be complaining over being hit by top players?

And how can suggesting reset after three month with a ranking board not be a suggestion of a solution?

I don’t see the point with the game after a kingdom dominates the server. It is like continuing a game of the strategic board game Risk for ever after someone have won.

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